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	<title>Comments on: general questions about DocBook -&gt; LaTeX</title>
	<link>http://uucode.com/blog/2007/02/23/general-questions-about-docbook-latex/</link>
	<description>advocating olpa's open source developments</description>
	<pubDate>Sun, 01 Aug 2010 00:14:40 +0000</pubDate>
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	<item>
		<title>By: olpa</title>
		<link>http://uucode.com/blog/2007/02/23/general-questions-about-docbook-latex/#comment-8259</link>
		<dc:creator>olpa</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 19 Mar 2007 05:09:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://uucode.com/blog/2007/02/23/general-questions-about-docbook-latex/#comment-8259</guid>
		<description>&gt; Texml would be really helpul if it could provide a higher level of abstraction, ... support footnotes in tables, in titles.
In this case it would be not TeXML, but an alternative to LaTeX and ConTeXt. Why not, I'm thinking about chances of creating a competing system, but it'd be not TeXML.

You do understand TeXML right:

&gt; It is just the same calls than you would do in latex, but in a much more verbose way since it is done with XML tags.

But you ignore the reason of this approach. "Write latex with XSL stylesheets" is nightmare, at least for me. But using TeXML as an intermediate language is an easy ride for me.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>> Texml would be really helpul if it could provide a higher level of abstraction, &#8230; support footnotes in tables, in titles.<br />
In this case it would be not TeXML, but an alternative to LaTeX and ConTeXt. Why not, I&#8217;m thinking about chances of creating a competing system, but it&#8217;d be not TeXML.</p>
<p>You do understand TeXML right:</p>
<p>> It is just the same calls than you would do in latex, but in a much more verbose way since it is done with XML tags.</p>
<p>But you ignore the reason of this approach. &#8220;Write latex with XSL stylesheets&#8221; is nightmare, at least for me. But using TeXML as an intermediate language is an easy ride for me.</p>
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		<title>By: marsgui</title>
		<link>http://uucode.com/blog/2007/02/23/general-questions-about-docbook-latex/#comment-8256</link>
		<dc:creator>marsgui</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Mar 2007 21:21:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://uucode.com/blog/2007/02/23/general-questions-about-docbook-latex/#comment-8256</guid>
		<description>I would not say that dblatex is better than something else. Most of people prefer the FO way, others prefer jadetex or passivetex, just because it can handle more languages that dblatex can. I bet that there are people who prefer db2latex just because they still can call xsltproc themselves. I was about to forget another thing: there are still many bugs in dblatex.

Knowing who is the best is not the point. Actually, if you want some technical credits, speak when you can bring a valuable thing, and avoid comparison to an hypothetical best solution that you cannot implement yourself.

As a technical feedback (and there's no bashing here) I think that texml is an interesting approach, but the current XML vocabulary is useless. It is just the same calls than you would do in latex, but in a much more verbose way since it is done with XML tags.

Texml would be really helpul if it could provide a higher level of abstraction, and if it would care for you about all the packages to load, hide the tricky package orders, hide the babel stuff clashes, provide the patches to some known latex bugs, call context instead of latex without changing anything, handle complex tables, handle a nice layout abstraction, support verbatim environments in footnotes or in tables, support footnotes in tables, in titles. Until you can provide these features I'll continue to write latex with XSL stylesheets.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I would not say that dblatex is better than something else. Most of people prefer the FO way, others prefer jadetex or passivetex, just because it can handle more languages that dblatex can. I bet that there are people who prefer db2latex just because they still can call xsltproc themselves. I was about to forget another thing: there are still many bugs in dblatex.</p>
<p>Knowing who is the best is not the point. Actually, if you want some technical credits, speak when you can bring a valuable thing, and avoid comparison to an hypothetical best solution that you cannot implement yourself.</p>
<p>As a technical feedback (and there&#8217;s no bashing here) I think that texml is an interesting approach, but the current XML vocabulary is useless. It is just the same calls than you would do in latex, but in a much more verbose way since it is done with XML tags.</p>
<p>Texml would be really helpul if it could provide a higher level of abstraction, and if it would care for you about all the packages to load, hide the tricky package orders, hide the babel stuff clashes, provide the patches to some known latex bugs, call context instead of latex without changing anything, handle complex tables, handle a nice layout abstraction, support verbatim environments in footnotes or in tables, support footnotes in tables, in titles. Until you can provide these features I&#8217;ll continue to write latex with XSL stylesheets.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: olpa</title>
		<link>http://uucode.com/blog/2007/02/23/general-questions-about-docbook-latex/#comment-8255</link>
		<dc:creator>olpa</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 Mar 2007 04:56:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://uucode.com/blog/2007/02/23/general-questions-about-docbook-latex/#comment-8255</guid>
		<description>Hello Benoit, (sorry if I found your name incorrectly)

first of all, I'd like to say thanks. At the moment, dblatex is the best way to publish DocBook documentation using the open source tools.

However, being the best at the moment doesn't mean being the best. Bashing the projects is the Right Thing, as the insulted authors will think how to improve the state of art.

&gt; Consodoc claims to create beautiful PDF, but the guide is not that beautiful

Please don't mix up the following:

* beautiful in the sense that there is no overfull boxes, hanging lines etc,
* beautiful in the sense that there is a lot of funny Paper 2.0 stuff.

I know the Guide could be improved. But not the second way.

&gt; ... and the overall tool is rather a big python makefile than a finished solution.

You are totally right. It's a big python makefile. It's a _framework_.

&gt; please prove what you say

Sorry, time is required. Time, time, and it'll appear.

&gt; share all your great latex expertise

I'm not a great expert.

&gt; to the other free projects. I'd be glad to modestly integrate them.

No! Dblatex uses the very wrong way, it generates LaTeX code directly by XSLT. I don't want to encourage such approach.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hello Benoit, (sorry if I found your name incorrectly)</p>
<p>first of all, I&#8217;d like to say thanks. At the moment, dblatex is the best way to publish DocBook documentation using the open source tools.</p>
<p>However, being the best at the moment doesn&#8217;t mean being the best. Bashing the projects is the Right Thing, as the insulted authors will think how to improve the state of art.</p>
<p>> Consodoc claims to create beautiful PDF, but the guide is not that beautiful</p>
<p>Please don&#8217;t mix up the following:</p>
<p>* beautiful in the sense that there is no overfull boxes, hanging lines etc,<br />
* beautiful in the sense that there is a lot of funny Paper 2.0 stuff.</p>
<p>I know the Guide could be improved. But not the second way.</p>
<p>> &#8230; and the overall tool is rather a big python makefile than a finished solution.</p>
<p>You are totally right. It&#8217;s a big python makefile. It&#8217;s a _framework_.</p>
<p>> please prove what you say</p>
<p>Sorry, time is required. Time, time, and it&#8217;ll appear.</p>
<p>> share all your great latex expertise</p>
<p>I&#8217;m not a great expert.</p>
<p>> to the other free projects. I&#8217;d be glad to modestly integrate them.</p>
<p>No! Dblatex uses the very wrong way, it generates LaTeX code directly by XSLT. I don&#8217;t want to encourage such approach.</p>
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		<title>By: marsgui</title>
		<link>http://uucode.com/blog/2007/02/23/general-questions-about-docbook-latex/#comment-8254</link>
		<dc:creator>marsgui</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 10 Mar 2007 01:35:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://uucode.com/blog/2007/02/23/general-questions-about-docbook-latex/#comment-8254</guid>
		<description>You promised texml will overclass the other non-maintanable XML to TeX solution. It is not yet the case. Consodoc claims to create beautiful PDF, but the guide is not that beautiful and the overall tool is rather a big python makefile than a finished solution.

Instead of bashing other projects, please prove what you say, and feel free to submit and share all your great latex expertise to the other free projects. I'd be glad to modestly integrate them.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You promised texml will overclass the other non-maintanable XML to TeX solution. It is not yet the case. Consodoc claims to create beautiful PDF, but the guide is not that beautiful and the overall tool is rather a big python makefile than a finished solution.</p>
<p>Instead of bashing other projects, please prove what you say, and feel free to submit and share all your great latex expertise to the other free projects. I&#8217;d be glad to modestly integrate them.</p>
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